Just read, no need to comment unless worth it

[JCBRAVE]

I am fed up with the talk that Vince Young is not good enough any more. Where were the critics when a twenty year old Vince Young carried the Texas Longhorns to a national championship, arguably the biggest football program in the country? How come no one was attacking VY after his rookie campaign and rookie of the year honors? He sure was loved when he put the Titans back in the playoffs only in his second year. Why now years after we found out VY was no genius or prototypical quarterback does everyone suddenly want to push VY to the side to make way for guys like Chris Simms and Patrick Ramsey? Half the critics out there don’t know what a three point stance is, but are suddenly football gurus. LOL yea right. The high school version of VY could have gone any direction in football from TE to LB, but because of his arm was thrown in as a QB. I don’t believe a player has to match any guidelines in order to play the role of a football player. For instance I know plenty of great CB’s that are not 5’11”- 6’2” and still play outstanding football. VY has odd mechanics, wow so….. He is still able to put the ball through tight windows. You can’t blame VY for lack of weapons. Not until now does the Titans offense have anyone to gain first downs. Finally the offense is coming along after five lousy seasons. Sure defense wins championships, but offense will win those games leading to the championship. I can’t go against Coach Fisher’s system it’s a proven way of winning, but why win by a little when you could win by more. As a fan I would prefer my team to put games away before the clock reads 00:01. Countless number of times the Titans won games in the final seconds. An elite team in the NFL can’t win games before the fourth quarter, why? Some people believe the Titans are the top team going into the 2009 season. I do, but no one other than Titans fans will think that if we can’t bring along the offense to play at an NFL level. Our college offense was lame because of Vince??? It sucked because we continually re vamp our defense and don’t give our QB help. McNair just about had everything on his side; a great RB, a phenomenal TE, quality WR’s in Mason and others, and he was very similar to Young. If a QB doesn’t get the help he will only be as good as a defense allows. We’ve seen Vince have to take games from teams: the Texans, the Giants, and the Eagles. All good teams now, Vince has out played them before. He finally could be great with time under his belt, a developing offense, and now a real true helper in Chris Johnson. What does bringing in Ramsey really do for anyone beside fill an empty roster spot? It might be to help push Vince, but I see him having plenty of motivation going into this season. He is playing second fiddle to a banjo. A banjo is running our team. We need the electrifying VY, not an average guy ready to receive his AARP card. Having three QB’s on a team that realistically doesn’t even need two is a bit crazy. While were adding players, why not grab an extra kicker. At least our kicking game is always on. Here is the deal: VY may not be your regular QB, neither is our offense. We need play makers not QB’s and KR’s. If the Titans care much for that position they would invest in WR’s and not so much in RB’s and DE’s. Basically VY is more than a QB, he is a champion, no matter how, he makes sure he’s winning. It is too bad most people lost their respect for Young when he got hurt. Don't believe what you read (media who-ha), believe what you see. I cant wait to see VY win a Super Bowl. It will happen, hopefully its with the Titans.

[wari0]

i see you put no need to comment but, i want to. I would love to see an electrifying VY back on the field. I am hoping he is able to accomplish that and he has commited himself to the offseason program so hopefully that will pay off. I still think he can do it but, its not going to be easy. I really wouldnt be suprised if he makes it or if he doesnt at this point.

[Conan Oh Brian]

I have a comment. Use the enter key on your keyboard from time to time. :evilgrin

If you voted for anything but "don't know" then you are only fooling yourself.

[JCBRAVE]

I have a comment. Use the enter key on your keyboard from time to time. :evilgrin

If you voted for anything but "don't know" then you are only fooling yourself.

Unnecessary post. People just talk for the fact they can. IM yourself or go MySpacing people

[Sect309Fan]

I can’t go against Coach Fisher’s system it’s a proven way of winning, but why win by a little when you could win by more. As a fan I would prefer my team to put games away before the clock reads 00:01. Countless number of times the Titans won games in the final seconds.

Not last year. The Titans were tied for 1st place for having the biggest net points (points for minus points against) in the NFL. Really, the only game won in the final drive was the first Baltimore game.

I am trying to defeat the myth that the Titans are a low scoring team who barely eek out victories. The Titans scored more points last year than the supposedly high powered offense of the Denver Broncos. And we did do it with Collins as the QB, who played very well the last half of the season.


I will say that I don't think Vince is a hopeless case. I still believe that with a strong offseason and preseason, he can earn the starting job in 2010. If the Ravens could cut Trent Dilfer after he won a Super Bowl, the Titans can cut/trade Collins if Vince is ready in 2010. Fisher has been pretty vocal that Vince is still the future starter of the Titans, so we will just have to see if he is telling the truth or not.

And I did vote "I don't know".

[JCBRAVE]

Not last year. The Titans were tied for 1st place for having the biggest net points (points for minus points against) in the NFL. Really, the only game won in the final drive was the first Baltimore game.

I am trying to defeat the myth that the Titans are a low scoring team who barely eek out victories. The Titans scored more points last year than the supposedly high powered offense of the Denver Broncos. And we did do it with Collins as the QB, who played very well the last half of the season.


I will say that I don't think Vince is a hopeless case. I still believe that with a strong offseason and preseason, he can earn the starting job in 2010. If the Ravens could cut Trent Dilfer after he won a Super Bowl, the Titans can cut/trade Collins if Vince is ready in 2010. Fisher has been pretty vocal that Vince is still the future starter of the Titans, so we will just have to see if he is telling the truth or not.

And I did vote "I don't know".

I know the team was efficient, however I watched them settle for three inside the red zone too much. I know the offense will 'go' with either Collins or Young. The thing with Young is; at least when he was winning games it was him winning the games. Think of how good the offense would be with him running the offense and getting support. Collins didn't put us in the playoffs the way Young did. I see Collins complimenting our offense not being the offense. Vince simply did everything and it was a lot to do. Now he can rely on the help of team mates.

[Jones31]

Unnecessary post. People just talk for the fact they can. IM yourself or go MySpacing people

Someone needs a nap....

[Fairweather Fan]

If you voted for anything but "don't know" then you are only fooling yourself.

:thumbsup

[Yvette]

I voted don't know, too. I believe VY has the athleticism needed for the NFL and a basic skill set that can be further developed. What I don't know is if he has the temperament for the NFL. I sincerely hope he's been diligently working at answering that question.

[Jones31]

I voted don't know, but going back to what he did 2 years ago doesn't set any precedent for what he's doing now or might do, which isn't much. To say the Titans were settling for 3 inside the redzone, is going back to 2007. You can't pick and pull to actually make this argument stand up. As always what he did at Texas has no bearing on his NFL career besides where he got picked in the draft. Texas, 2006 season, ROY. Is all in the past, hasn't been seen since.

[TTP77]

going back to what he did 2 years ago doesn't set any precedent for what he's doing now or might do, which isn't much. To say the Titans were settling for 3 inside the redzone, is going back to 2007. You can't pick and pull to actually make this argument stand up. As always what he did at Texas has no bearing on his NFL career besides where he got picked in the draft. Texas, 2006 season, ROY. Is all in the past, hasn't been seen since.

You beat me to it. :thumbsup

[Sect309Fan]

Collins didn't put us in the playoffs the way Young did. I see Collins complimenting our offense not being the offense. Vince simply did everything and it was a lot to do. Now he can rely on the help of team mates.

I don't agree with that statement. In 2007, the Titans made it to the playoffs despite Vince Young's poor performance. In 2008, the Titans made it to the playoffs because of how effective Collins was. The defense was a large part of both seasons as well.

I can't think of any game in 2007 that Vince Young "won" (though 2006 was a different story). In 2008, Collins definitely "won" several games.

[StephenIsLEGEND]

For a thread not needing any comments, it sure has quite a bit. I'll throw in my 2 cents.

I like Vince. I defend him until i'm blue in the face. Why? He may not be the current starter, but he just needs a little time. He will be good, at least, I hope he will be. He got me excited for the Titans after watching him his rookie season. We were dominant. He was an electrifying player. He needs confidence back, and that sure won't happen if he can't see the field.

[DelawareTitans]

Paragraphs make posts much easier to read.

[Titanico]

This subject was quite analyzed at the TOMB.

-Any player is going to become a good one, if they don't commit themselves as much as they need.

- The College level is not the same one as the Pro one. Many SUCCESFUL College players have not had a decent career when entering the NFL. And I think that they come with the wrong mind set, by saying: They think they deserve the respect they had at their College teams. And that's assuming way too much from their side.

-It's very complicated to be or become a true NFL player, is a totally different breath. It's a different rythm, is not as easy as it looks. A player with a weak mind-set preparation for this, it's simple...will not succeed.

-It's solely in Young's hands to become succesful. He needs to show it in the trainning field, day after day...and if the time comes, he should show a good preparation as it could get, when he plays in a game.

And yes, we need the electrifying Vince Young. The problem is that he cut his own "switch" on 2007. And his future is uncertain thanks to his lack of capability: mental and workwise.

To finish, I think that he is in danger to exit being an another bust in the NFL.

[Conan Oh Brian]

Unnecessary post. People just talk for the fact they can. IM yourself or go MySpacing people

They like me.... They really like me.

[ZachLV27]

I didn't even need to open the thread to know it was about Vince Young. I could just tell from the title that screamed "Agree with me or don't respond!".

[TitansFan23]

Unnecessary post. People just talk for the fact they can. IM yourself or go MySpacing people

Please God, no more VY debates.

That poor horse is nothing but dust by now.

[Count Telecky]

How come no one was attacking VY after his rookie campaign and rookie of the year honors? He sure was loved when he put the Titans back in the playoffs only in his second year.

If I remember correctly, there were plenty of people on the TOMB that were critical of VY during that time period.

I am neither a VY hater or lover but I do love the Titans. If Vince turns things around I will support him and cheer for him. If he doesn't, then we need to have our back up plan because KC is not going to be around much longer.

[Jones31]

Shouldn't this be in the VY forum??????






What?

[shadowboxin']

This is not the TOMB, the Vince Young forum went down with its ship. It's time for change... move on people.










I propose a Patrick Ramsey forum.

[TitansFan23]

Patrick Ramsey should be starting.

If he was in that game against the Ravens...

[shadowboxin']

If they would just let Patrick be Patrick...

[titan122]

i also chose that i dont really know, but i do know i would love to see vince take care of business and not just work to get the starting job back but TAKE it back from the old man.

i keep thinkin of 8-8 that got him roy and then 10-6 and that was with a pisspoor oc. with some corrections and improvements i would love to see him electrify the titans nation once again. and maybe put some of the haters or as some of you call yourselves REALISTS to sleep.

[TitansFan23]

Ramsey owned at Tulane, and all you guys do is rag on him.

[titan122]

i know ramsey never won a national championship when he owned there at tulane but has he ever lead any team to the playoffs?

[Yvette]

I can't believe I read haters. Here, let me get you a shooter. In a big cup. Yep.

[TitansFan23]

Dunno, I’m just being facetious.

[shadowboxin']

It's very hot and I currently have no AC. I must spread the misery...

[titan122]

I can't believe I read haters. Here, let me get you a shooter. In a big cup. Yep.

that would be nice even better if you make it a double:p

[TitansFan23]

http://www.nathanwilson.com/codeigniter2x/core/nathanwilson/images/why/hater_tots.jpg

Yummy!

[titan122]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm. I should have had lunch today.

[wari0]

all this thread needs now is a car analogy to help me understand our quarterback situation... anyone? bueller?

[TitansFan23]

You see, Kerry is like a Ford LTD

And Vince is like a Corvette...

[Yvette]

that would be nice even better if you make it a double:p
It's more like x4 and you won't be taking anything personally about a 1/3 of the way down. You'll be smilin' and shootin' the chit with everyone :D

[titan122]

i try not to take anything personally too often especially when it comes to chattin w/ my fellow TITANITES as kimmy would have said.:D

[Titans and Turtles]

Unnecessary post. People just talk for the fact they can. IM yourself or go MySpacing people

Slow your roll here, Pilgrim.

I got a little newsflash for the way the TOMB worked, the way this board will likely work, and how the internet in general functions.

Don't post a one-sided oratory on the most controversial and divisive topic this board (and our previous) has ever seen, preface it with "please just read, don't comment", and expect to have that happen.

This board is free enough you can jump on here and start a flame war, which every VY thread is destined to become as long as he's a Titan, but don't ever think you can throw a jab/hook combo thread starter out there and demand people with the dissenting viewpoint merely take it and not respond.

I think you need to take your own advice. If you want a place to post a one-sided opinion on VY, I'd suggest you take it to YOUR myspace blog and disable comments.

Here, if you fire the first shot, get behind cover fast, because the return fire is headed your way.


Oh, and as for a car analogy, I'll use one to make the point I've stuck with on VY the whole time.

VY is an off-road 4X4. If you're willing to go off-road, take the risky mountain path, you'll make some amazing jumps, have a blast, and either end up winning the race or flying off a sheer cliff.

Collins is an old camaro. He could speed on straightaways pretty nice, but he's been prone to handling problems since he rolled off the asssembly line. He's gotten most of those under control now, but due to the age of the engine, he's not got nearly the top gear he once had. He obviously is going to have to stick to the road, as off-roading is definitely not an option.

Now, Fisher is the racing team manager. His gameplan, which he sticks to religiously, is to win by fuel economy. Stick on the road, let the other cars take risks, while slow and steady, we stick to the open highway. It's not flashy, it's not aggressive, but it works, and wins you a good share of the races. The problem is, the team owner, bought the VY rugged off-roadster.

Year one, Fisher wasn't planning on even using the 4X4, and when he had to, it was still just as it came to him. So he let it drive off-road. Through the forest, up the mountains, through the rock bed. And we made up a ton of ground and while we didn't win the race, we finished so much better than we thought we would, we decided we really liked the 4X4.

Now, for the next racing season, Fisher had time. He decided he and his chief mechanic, Chow, would modify his 4X4. Make it so it stays on the road, increase the fuel efficiency, higher top-speed. No more of this risky off-roading nonsense. This 4X4 would win on the highway, winning with better tires and better fuel management/efficiency. So they did.

And while the racing team still did pretty well in the race, it was due to the fuel management and pit strategy - and seemed to have little to do with the vehicle itself, which looked very out of place sticking to the long, straight, flat highway. But the 4X4 was determined to be a road-racer, not just an off-roader.

Well, the next year, on the first lap, the 4X4 still doesn't seem any better. Then, it hits a rut, and refuses to start back up again. They finally do, and it immediately has a flat tire. The team quickly pushes that old camaro back out, and low and behold, it's a success! Using fishers superior fuel strategy and tire strategy and highway course plotting, that camaro proves to be much better than the 4X4 at winning how Fisher wants his team to win. And the team ended up leading most of the race, the only down side is they get passed on the final 2 laps, and finish way worse than they thought they would.

Wow, that was much more than I thought I'd post on the car analogy.

[Old Oilers Fan]

This sucks that we can't comment. If Vince was / is so great then why is there a problem? :crazy

I sure miss Lascaux. :saywha

:lol

[TitanPop]

Not last year. The Titans were tied for 1st place for having the biggest net points (points for minus points against) in the NFL. Really, the only game won in the final drive was the first Baltimore game.

I am trying to defeat the myth that the Titans are a low scoring team who barely eek out victories. The Titans scored more points last year than the supposedly high powered offense of the Denver Broncos. And we did do it with Collins as the QB, who played very well the last half of the season.


I will say that I don't think Vince is a hopeless case. I still believe that with a strong offseason and preseason, he can earn the starting job in 2010. If the Ravens could cut Trent Dilfer after he won a Super Bowl, the Titans can cut/trade Collins if Vince is ready in 2010. Fisher has been pretty vocal that Vince is still the future starter of the Titans, so we will just have to see if he is telling the truth or not.

And I did vote "I don't know".

and then what happened to them? :lolhit

[TitanPop]

Slow your roll here, Pilgrim.

I got a little newsflash for the way the TOMB worked, the way this board will likely work, and how the internet in general functions.

Don't post a one-sided oratory on the most controversial and divisive topic this board (and our previous) has ever seen, preface it with "please just read, don't comment", and expect to have that happen...............

..............

Not what he said, :slap actually it was... " Just read, no need to comment unless worth it"

[Titans and Turtles]

Not what he said, :slap actually it was... " Just read, no need to comment unless worth it"



Yes, yes, but the clear implication is that he thought he could dictate what kind of response he'd get when throwing a VY thread out there. When you gather a huge amount of dry brush into a pile and douse it with gasoline, you don't get to dictate whether or not there's a fire.

And as far as the poll, I voted for what I truly want to see, not what i think. I voted that he's cut and plays for another team. I think that would be best for all concerned. We can continue on playing Fisherball without a QB who can't run it, VY can go to a team that might actually adapt to his strengths and actually allow him to do what he's good at.

[zonian]

Not what he said, :slap actually it was... " Just read, no need to comment unless worth it"

Well put, Pop. That is what he said...

What I wonder, is...

"Worth it" to whom?

Kinda subjective, wouldn't you say?

Do we vote???

[TitanPop]

Well put, Pop. That is what he said...

What I wonder, is...

"Worth it" to whom?

Kinda subjective, wouldn't you say?

Do we vote???

not worth it lol.......

wasn't trying to pick at ya T&T but he did say what he said, even if it wasn't worth it. :doh doh

[Fairweather Fan]

i try not to take anything personally too often especially when it comes to chattin w/ my fellow TITANITES as kimmy would have said.:D

OOOOOHHHHHHHHHH NNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! III"MMMM HHHAAAAAVVVVVVIIINNNNNGGGG FFFLLLAAAAAAASSSHHHHHHBBBACKS!!!!!! MMMMAAAAAKKKKEE IITTTTT SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTTTTOPPPP. :doh

[Yvette]

Do we vote???
Another question is, what we do at a tailgate? :lol

[315]

Is this like when we hear that obnoxious horn continually going off?

[Jones31]

I think so!

[315]

I wish that we could come up with a good counter attack.

[kytitansfan1]

I wish that we could come up with a good counter attack.

Group flatulence? :slap

[315]

That wont work... we need the horn from the General Jackson !!!!

[Jones31]

http://www.hornblasters.com/video.php

[titansikou]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_WnCJlq_kUA8/RmjanxOnIbI/AAAAAAAADRA/I1-g_0rIFa0/s200/trelawney.jpg

Will he/ won't he?

[don28]

I sooooooooo want to give my Andy Rooney-type diatribe on this subject. I'll try to keep it to myself. For now....

[hooktool]

The poll should have the option that VY regains the job at some point and has a good career-but that doesn't automatically mean winning the SB. Though we would hope so.:)

How about at the tailgate we choose sides-pro/con VY, and every time the horn blows you have to switch arguments?:lolhit

John

[JimOkc]

I don't know. I do know that whoever is taking snaps will have my support. I personally think that there aren't a lot of teams that have 2 pro-bowl and playoff experienced qbs on the roster. :)

[gnarl]

omgosh ppl!!

its so obvious VY is much better and needs to be the starter.

if kerry was so good, wouldnt he have his own find meat selection also?

http://blog.oregonlive.com/tailgate_impact/2008/09/medium_VYFoodsSm-full.jpg

sorry had to do it :D

[felloffthewagon]

mmmmmmm Brisket.

[Mike McFan]

I voted don't know, too. I believe VY has the athleticism needed for the NFL and a basic skill set that can be further developed. What I don't know is if he has the temperament for the NFL. I sincerely hope he's been diligently working at answering that question.

This !:thumbsup
Thanks for saving me some time Yosh !

[Jones31]

omgosh ppl!!

its so obvious VY is much better and needs to be the starter.

if kerry was so good, wouldnt he have his own find meat selection also?

http://blog.oregonlive.com/tailgate_impact/2008/09/medium_VYFoodsSm-full.jpg

sorry had to do it :D

It's funny he violated someone else's copyright with that.

[Conan Oh Brian]

It's funny he violated someone else's copyright with that.

No way. It is called sampling. :D

[titansikou]

Hmm.. A polite way to ask this: has anyone actually tried a Vince Young meat product?

[Toronto]

I have absolutely no clue what will become of Vince. Hell I doubt anyone knows.

[Sect309Fan]

Hmm.. A polite way to ask this: has anyone actually tried a Vince Young meat product?

Terry made some at one of the tailgates last year. I thought it tasted fine.

[315]

Hmm.. A polite way to ask this: has anyone actually tried a Vince Young meat product?

I know kimmy would if Vince would let her.

[felloffthewagon]

i know kimmy would if vince would let her.

lmfao!!!!!!

[Fairweather Fan]

It seems as though many of these post were definately worth it.:lolhit

[StephenIsLEGEND]

I've had the sausage. It wasn't very good.

[Conan Oh Brian]

I've had the sausage. It wasn't very good.

Tobias Beecher?

[titansikou]

Tobias Beecher?

I had to check this reference on wikipedia. Sounds kinda brutal.

[TitansFan23]

I know kimmy would if Vince would let her.

POTW! :lmao

[hooktool]

I know kimmy would if Vince would let her.


LOL.....No fair unless you invite her here to comment on that.:lol

John

[gnarl]

LOL.....No fair unless you invite her here to comment on that.:lol

John

dont worry, she will be on the board soon.

she only has a free email, but im trying to help her out!

besides...the board could always use some threads on how awesome tony brown is :lol

[315]

dont worry, she will be on the board soon.

she only has a free email, but im trying to help her out!

besides...the board could always use some threads on how awesome tony brown is :lol

I just hope that Tony doesnt start peddling his meat.

[Nintova]

Slow your roll here, Pilgrim.

I got a little newsflash for the way the TOMB worked, the way this board will likely work, and how the internet in general functions.

Don't post a one-sided oratory on the most controversial and divisive topic this board (and our previous) has ever seen, preface it with "please just read, don't comment", and expect to have that happen.

This board is free enough you can jump on here and start a flame war, which every VY thread is destined to become as long as he's a Titan, but don't ever think you can throw a jab/hook combo thread starter out there and demand people with the dissenting viewpoint merely take it and not respond.

I think you need to take your own advice. If you want a place to post a one-sided opinion on VY, I'd suggest you take it to YOUR myspace blog and disable comments.

Here, if you fire the first shot, get behind cover fast, because the return fire is headed your way.


Oh, and as for a car analogy, I'll use one to make the point I've stuck with on VY the whole time.

VY is an off-road 4X4. If you're willing to go off-road, take the risky mountain path, you'll make some amazing jumps, have a blast, and either end up winning the race or flying off a sheer cliff.

Collins is an old camaro. He could speed on straightaways pretty nice, but he's been prone to handling problems since he rolled off the asssembly line. He's gotten most of those under control now, but due to the age of the engine, he's not got nearly the top gear he once had. He obviously is going to have to stick to the road, as off-roading is definitely not an option.

Now, Fisher is the racing team manager. His gameplan, which he sticks to religiously, is to win by fuel economy. Stick on the road, let the other cars take risks, while slow and steady, we stick to the open highway. It's not flashy, it's not aggressive, but it works, and wins you a good share of the races. The problem is, the team owner, bought the VY rugged off-roadster.

Year one, Fisher wasn't planning on even using the 4X4, and when he had to, it was still just as it came to him. So he let it drive off-road. Through the forest, up the mountains, through the rock bed. And we made up a ton of ground and while we didn't win the race, we finished so much better than we thought we would, we decided we really liked the 4X4.

Now, for the next racing season, Fisher had time. He decided he and his chief mechanic, Chow, would modify his 4X4. Make it so it stays on the road, increase the fuel efficiency, higher top-speed. No more of this risky off-roading nonsense. This 4X4 would win on the highway, winning with better tires and better fuel management/efficiency. So they did.

And while the racing team still did pretty well in the race, it was due to the fuel management and pit strategy - and seemed to have little to do with the vehicle itself, which looked very out of place sticking to the long, straight, flat highway. But the 4X4 was determined to be a road-racer, not just an off-roader.

Well, the next year, on the first lap, the 4X4 still doesn't seem any better. Then, it hits a rut, and refuses to start back up again. They finally do, and it immediately has a flat tire. The team quickly pushes that old camaro back out, and low and behold, it's a success! Using fishers superior fuel strategy and tire strategy and highway course plotting, that camaro proves to be much better than the 4X4 at winning how Fisher wants his team to win. And the team ended up leading most of the race, the only down side is they get passed on the final 2 laps, and finish way worse than they thought they would.

Wow, that was much more than I thought I'd post on the car analogy.

So much win .... SO much.

[Jones31]

I'd like to comment again.























okay I'm done.

[pookha]

titans and turtles..
hmm interesting..
but the nfl is daytona and while off the road racing might have worked in college
and win you championships things are at a different level in the nfl.

;)

it is interesting how many championship wining college qbs and especially heisman winners just dont make it in the nfl.

[Titans and Turtles]

titans and turtles..
hmm interesting..
but the nfl is daytona and while off the road racing might have worked in college
and win you championships things are at a different level in the nfl.

;)

it is interesting how many championship wining college qbs and especially heisman winners just dont make it in the nfl.

Sure, I agree. The mistake was taking a 4X4 vehicle to race at Daytona with. But once we had that 4X4, it is pure stubborness to not try to use what you have. No, I don't believe running a texas style spread is the path to the superbowl. But shoving VY under center and shackling him into the pocket was equally foolish.

[Jones31]

No one besides a guy wearing number 10 kept him in the pocket. His coaches have said that time and time again.

[Titans and Turtles]

No one besides a guy wearing number 10 kept him in the pocket. His coaches have said that time and time again.

To cover there ass, they did. After theyworked on him all off-season and pre-season on his "progressions" and checkdowns. It is my belief that they drilled it into his brain to throw rather than run, and only near the middle of the season, when they realized wha they had wrought (A QB who neither threw nor ran), did Fisher reverse course and begin saying he wanted Vince to run. Too little too late by then - they had VY convinced he had to stay in the pocket to be a "real NFL quarterback", and he never gave up that idea.

Plus, Fisher and/or Chow called the plays. They refused to actually call a QB sweep. Fisher just doesn't do that. He wants the QB to scramble if and only if the pass play completely breaks down. If you want to force your QB to run, if you reallu have any intention of actually letting him run, you call a freakin QB keeper now and then . The Titans, in Fisherball, never call designed runs - and with VY at the helm, that's a crime.

[Jones31]

Well believe what you want since Vince himself said "Im a Quart a back" I'd say he was intent on proving people he could stand in the pocket.

[pookha]

Sure, I agree. The mistake was taking a 4X4 vehicle to race at Daytona with. But once we had that 4X4, it is pure stubborness to not try to use what you have. No, I don't believe running a texas style spread is the path to the superbowl. But shoving VY under center and shackling him into the pocket was equally foolish.

really,
other qbs like mcnair were able to adapt to a more pro style level of play.
perhaps they or rather adams thought vince would be able to do the same thing.

every qb who makes the transition to the nfl had to bring their level of play and knowledge of the game to a whole new level.


and fisher started saying pretty early in the 2007 season that they had plays for vince to run but vince was opting out of using them.

perhaps vince saw the writing on the wall after his injury in early 2007, that he would either had to adapt or his career was going to be pretty short if he just depended on his legs.

and if they did try to fill his brain on working on his progressions ect.. well they evidently didnt do it enough considering jaws noted vince didnt seem to be showing any progress.

[Titans and Turtles]

really,
other qbs like mcnair were able to adapt to a more pro style level of play.
perhaps they or rather adams thought vince would be able to do the same thing.

every qb who makes the transition to the nfl had to bring their level of play and knowledge of the game to a whole new level.


and fisher started saying pretty early in the 2007 season that they had plays for vince to run but vince was opting out of using them.

perhaps vince saw the writing on the wall after his injury in early 2007, that he would either had to adapt or his career was going to be pretty short if he just depended on his legs.

and if they did try to fill his brain on working on his progressions ect.. well they evidently didnt do it enough considering jaws noted vince didnt seem to be showing any progress.

Michael Vick. They let Vick be Vick (criminal dogfighting aside, for the moment).

"But how many superbowls did Vick win, Turtles? Answer us that?! His teams rarely won!"

True, but imagine how pitiful Vick would have looked if they drilled into his head that he had to stay in the pocket and make his checkdowns.

McNair could run, yes, but his nickname was Air McNair because he also threw the hell out of the ball. McNair was a passer who did some running. VY was a shotgun-spread running QB who did some passing.

[Yvette]

McNair could run, yes, but his nickname was Air McNair because he also threw the hell out of the ball. McNair was a passer who did some running. VY was a shotgun-spread running QB who did some passing.
There are times when I can't see the forest for the trees and I think VY is one of those times. I know you've probably posted similar stuff over the last two years, but for some reason it just sunk in with that last paragraph.

Whether or not VY succeeds in the NFL, he sure as hell isn't going to succeed here unless something changes. Is VY the proverbial leopard who can't change it's spots? Is Fisher?

[Titans and Turtles]

There are times when I can't see the forest for the trees and I think VY is one of those times. I know you've probably posted similar stuff over the last two years, but for some reason it just sunk in with that last paragraph.

Whether or not VY succeeds in the NFL, he sure as hell isn't going to succeed here unless something changes. Is VY the proverbial leopard who can't change it's spots? Is Fisher?

Welcome to the party! :)

And i believe it's both - VY only knows how to play VY football, Fisher only runs Fisherball. Trying to meet in the middle has brought VY from the confident, even arrogant, win at all costs guy we saw in 06 into the heap of whining, crying, tantruming mess we have now.

At this point, I only blame Bud Adams. VY was brought to a team with a philosiphy he could never succeed under, and Fisher was given a QB he would never be able to mold into playing the way he wants.

That's why I pray for a trade. Let the Titans salvage some value, even if it's a really low draft pick or a special teams player, and give VY a chance to go to a team that might have a more open offensive strategy, and see if VY could be VY again. Keeping him here prolongs everyone's suffering.

[Yvette]

When I typed my last post I was silently cursing Bud.

Now I'm gonna have to rethink my emo perception of VY. I know that any time I've tried to be something I'm not, all hell breaks loose too.

[shadowboxin']

Emmitt Smith would like you all to know that leopards have stripes.

Seriously though, Vince is in a no-win situation IMO. Kerry's virtually assured the starting job unless he goes full-Testaverde, and even then he'd still get the start unless Vince was absolutely perfect in camp/preseason. Barring injury, there's almost no way for Vince to get on the field this season.

Without getting on the field, it's going to be pretty hard to prove his worth to the team, and so after this season he's almost guaranteed to be cut. Can't keep two QB's making starting money, and since Kerry's had the job all season (probably taking us to the playoffs again), he's going to get the nod. Vince hardly has any room to improve his value to another team (if he's cut he'll go somewhere regardless, he'll just start at the bottom of the depth chart again).

Sticky situation for #10...

[Yvette]

Emmitt Smith would like you all to know that leopards have stripes.
Fill me in please? I missed that story somewhere along the way or was too busy hating the 'boys to care.

[shadowboxin']

Fill me in please? I missed that story somewhere along the way or was too busy hating the 'boys to care.


1. “The stripes of a leopard”

Back in Week 3 of the 2007 season, Emmitt was asked about the ability of Randy Moss to be a leader in New England. Emmitt’s response? “You cannot change the stripes of a leopard.” Indeed Emmitt, indeed.

Emmitt Smith, you will be missed.

Top 10 Emmitt Smith ESPN Quotes (http://www.manolith.com/2009/02/20/emmitt-smith-espn-quotes/)

[titansikou]

I didn't mind ES as a commentator, he didn't bother me nearly as much as Boomer Esiason.

As for Vince Young, I don't know where you guys get your energy from. I just can't talk about him anymore unless it's in the context of a joke. Not that I don't like him as a player, just... Vince Young Forum syndrome. He's one heck of an entertaining football player.

[Fairweather Fan]

I didn't mind ES as a commentator, he didn't bother me nearly as much as Boomer Esiason.

As for Vince Young, I don't know where you guys get your energy from. I just can't talk about him anymore unless it's in the context of a joke. Not that I don't like him as a player, just... Vince Young Forum syndrome. He's one heck of an entertaining football player.

Agreed. Everything that could possibly be said about the VY issue has been said over and over again. I would like to see VY succeed, but at this point it is more fun to crack jokes. It is just to easy.

[MillaKilla8]

McNair could run, yes, but his nickname was Air McNair because he also threw the hell out of the ball. McNair was a passer who did some running. VY was a shotgun-spread running QB who did some passing.

word.:thumbsup

[Yvette]

Everything that could possibly be said about the VY issue has been said over and over again.
But it took me two years of this to finally entertain another angle :lolhit

[pookha]

Michael Vick. They let Vick be Vick (criminal dogfighting aside, for the moment).

"But how many superbowls did Vick win, Turtles? Answer us that?! His teams rarely won!"

True, but imagine how pitiful Vick would have looked if they drilled into his head that he had to stay in the pocket and make his checkdowns.

McNair could run, yes, but his nickname was Air McNair because he also threw the hell out of the ball. McNair was a passer who did some running. VY was a shotgun-spread running QB who did some passing.

but as time went on and teams learned how to defend him he became less effective.
his hey day pretty much was the green bay playoff game.

you can simplify and adapt to a qb of limited ability to progress only for awhile.
this isnt college ball. nfl defense is being coached by people who live and breathe the game a lot of college coaches cant imagine.
nfl defense is played by the best players who have been players for years not one to three.

new england was one of the first teams that had some success containing vince.
once that happens other teams can adapt their own means of containment.


see i dont totally buy the well vince can only be what vince is.. we couldnt have expected vince to adapt.

in my world i have had to learn and adapt all through my life.
when i first went to work were i am now hardly anything was done on computer. now 80 percent is.
i had to learn and adapt.

really almost every qb has to adapt to a far faster and more complex game that they faced in college.
yes steve did through the ball back in college but the defensives he faced in college didnt come close to preparing him for what he would face in the nfl.
in the end i dont know if vince is unwilling to try and learn or unable to do so.

we are not just talking just style of offense for him to run but the basics of being able to read a defense or run through basic progression.

the whole no one can teach me anything opens up the realm he dosnt want to learn.
some of the stuff chow said opens it up to he dosnt have the patience to learn.

i suspect between now and first week of augsut we will get an answer.

as for emmitt..
yeah he was spectacle ; you never knew what was going to come out.

[Yvette]

Not everyone has the ability to adapt to their circumstances.

When nature vs nuture, nature always wins.

We don't know VY's nature and he may not know either. Only time will tell.

[zonian]

Only time will tell.

Amen.

[Titanico]

the whole no one can teach me anything opens up the realm he dosnt want to learn.
some of the stuff chow said opens it up to he dosnt have the patience to learn.

i suspect between now and first week of augsut we will get an answer.



And he showed that he doesn't have the mental strength to correct what needs to. That's a strong barrier, not only for the coaches and him, but to himself as well.

Good post, pookha.

[MrBean]

If I remember correctly, there were plenty of people on the TOMB that were critical of VY during that time period.



I was one of them.

But in the long run I have always wanted my QB to be able to Throw first, run second.... no the other way around.

[Yvette]

There were plenty of people everywhere that were critical. TV, print, web, terrestrial and satellite air.

[Jones31]

Is this thread "worth it"???

[gnarl]

i think vince seems like he doesnt want to learn because he lost the love and what he found fun in the game. it can happen to anyone. its jsut a matter of trying to find the love in it again.

why would you want to learn something you dont enjoy?
you can be forced to learn, but it wont stick as well as if you applied yourself

[wari0]

can VY become the comeback player of the year if he starts and performs well next year? Also, Can we make this thread a "answer a question about VY with a question about VY" thread?

[Zephyr]

can VY become the comeback player of the year if he starts and performs well next year? Also, Can we make this thread a "answer a question about VY with a question about VY" thread?

How can he be the comeback player of the year if he doesn't play?

[ZachLV27]

How can he be the comeback player of the year if he doesn't play?

Water boys are important too. That and he can use his "I-Pod" to find out scores of the other games for the rest of the team.

[Zephyr]

Gatorade not only quenches your thirst better, it tastes better too.

[ZachLV27]

Gatorade not only quenches your thirst better, it tastes better too.

Tap water is cheaper and we all know Bud likes to be cheap.

[Zephyr]

Tap water is cheaper and we all know Bud likes to be cheap.

Maybe Bud can get VY some better weapons out there...like an auto-fill cooler dispenser, 11 cup serving trey (specialized for starters), crushed ice instead of cubed and those little umbrellas to keep the drinks cool.

[wari0]

Maybe Bud can get VY some better weapons out there...like an auto-fill cooler dispenser, 11 cup serving trey (specialized for starters), crushed ice instead of cubed and those little umbrellas to keep the drinks cool.

VY will revolutionize the waterboy position - (edited to add that this was just a joke and doesnt in any way say how i feel about VY or his situation... Put me in the time will tell category)

[Bobcat]

Gatorade not only quenches your thirst better, it tastes better too.

Gaaaaaaaaaatoraaaaaaaade.

H2O!

[TitansGiantsBears]

I had to vote "Truthfully don't know" since it was an option and truthfully no one here has the ability to see into the future. If I had to take a guess at any one of the other three, I'd lean toward bust but he'll probably finish his career elsewhere if that's the case. I haven't seen anything from Vince to make me believe otherwise. I'd like to see him succeed, but I just don't think it will happen. He seems to lack the mental facilities to grasp the NFL game and his mechanics are poor. That combination doesn't inspire confidence.